Romans 8

ROMANS 8

8:1-17

before:
7:22-24
22For in my inner being I delight in God's law; 23but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. 24What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death?

1. My mind wants to do good, but in the end my mind succumbed and ended up doing the other way.
2. sinful nature.

after:
8:5-10
5Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6The mind of sinful man^[e] is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; 7the sinful mind^[f] is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. 8Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God. 9You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. 10But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness.

1. we now have the holy spirit as a helper to set our mind on what the spirit desires, we are not succumbed and ended up doing the other way anymore.
2. the sinful nature *is* still there but ... see number 1.


When you accept Christ, Holy Spirit will automatically reside in you. Period. It's not possible to accept Christ without receiving the Holy Spirit. You, however still have the freedom to choose to suppress or ignore it.



18 - 27

past: we were saved
present: we being save (sanctification)
future: glorification

- creation (people and nature) is "decaying" and in the state of "frustation" as an effect of sin (see genesis 3, ground is cursed etc).
- why suffering? because we're not in perfect state (see point #1) why God let it happen? we don't know, but God let it happen. for believer one of the possible reason is to build character (see romans 5 discussion)
- holy spirit is a real entity
- the work of holy spirit is both active and reactive. In this passage, the holy spirit is working proactively to convey what we cannot utter/communicate to God


28-39

works for *goods* of those *who* love Him who have been *called*.
good = doesnt have anything to do with your happiness but rather with His purpose (His purpose in your life, His purpose in blah in blah in blah..)... so many purposes ... all are leading to what? God's plan is not comprehensible right now.
who = this doesnt apply to everybody
called = God dies for everybody, so the calling is extended to everyone... the difference is that whether you love him back or not. the biblical base is yet to be found.. pending.

predestined n foreknew --> foreknew explains predestination.

Romans 7

1-6

not much of interest here, the main idea is just that we have died to the law (7:4) and we now lives in Christ not in Law.. the apostle gave a good analogy here (7:2-3), place yourself as the wife, law as the first husband, Christ as the second husband.
the key points are:
1. you have died to the law thru Christ
2. now law is no more, you live in christ only

something comes up during discussion:

TIME SEQUENCE

+ Abraham
.
.
.
.
.
+
+
+ Jewish community
+
+
+
o
o
o Christ
o
o
.
.
. Christians
.
.
and on and on till the end of time

abraham:
faith
no law

jewish community:
some have faith, some just obeying the law but have no faith
definitely there's law of course

christ coming:
all ppl with faith are saved (salvation applies retro-actively -- Iben, 2007)
the law becomes more like a moral standard (because law by definition has to have consequences/penalty, and the consequence of the law has been taken care of).

7-12

- The law was intended to let you know what is wrong and right
- Sin fully perceived because because there's law
- Is the law sin? No.
- The law was good
- Side effect of law: human sinful nature brings us desire to sin against the law
- Law "that was intended to bring life actually brought death" (7:10)

- Law is just a law, it does not contain any provision of mercy or grace for relief.

13-25

We sin against our will, we want to abide by God's words but yet what comes out is sin all over again. This is why Law can't save us, it just points which is right and which is wrong. Human by nature will end up sin against it, we are doomed if there's only The Law without Christ.

pending questions:

1. mechanics of sinful nature, where did that come from? when did it start to exist?